She Sold Everything And Moved To Paris Without Speaking French: Change Changes Everything

In this episode, I sit down with Wani Iris Manly, an IP lawyer, speaker, author, and change expert whose life took a radical turn after she sold everything, left Miami, and moved to Paris without speaking French or knowing anyone there. Ms. Manly shares how a New Year’s Eve moment of prayer, reflection, and radical self-responsibility led her to confront her limiting beliefs and open herself up to a completely different life.

Throughout the conversation, Ms. Manly explains how change is not merely external, but deeply internal. We talk about the fear of change, the fear of the unknown, and how many people resist the very transition that may be calling them into a fuller life. Her journey from a high-powered legal career into speaking, writing, and helping others navigate disruption shows how identity, purpose, and calling can evolve when someone is willing to let go of what feels safe.

I also share parts of my own journey, including the transition from being a nuclear operator in the military to becoming a full-time podcaster, speaker, comedian, and creator. We discuss how difficult it can be to leave behind an identity that other people chose for you, especially when so much time, money, training, and family expectation were invested into it. Sometimes the identity we grieve was never truly ours; it was simply the role the world told us was practical, safe, or respectable.

https://wanimanly.com/

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*Couple O' Nukes LLC and Mr. Whiskey are not licensed medical entities, nor do they take responsibility for any advice or information put forth by guests. Take all advice at your own risk.

Transcript

 Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to another episode of Couple O' Nukes. As always, I'm your host, Mr. Whiskey, and I'm currently staying in Japan, and one of the things I've talked about in a few recent episodes is the amazing impact of global connection, of intercultural exchange. And, you know, a lot of people ask me, "Mr. Whiskey, you went to Japan. You don't speak-" I speak some Japanese, you know, from TV shows and stuff. I quote movie lines. But, uh, you know, they're like, "You're moving to a place without speaking the language, without really being a part of the culture, and kind of just dropping everything right after you moved. How does that feel?" And that gets me excited because today's guest has done something similar, only my temporary stay is temporary. Our guest just moved there. No speaking French. Sold everything, moves to Paris. So I'm excited for this conversation of, you know, how life can unfold. And of course, we're gonna talk about a lot of other stuff, difficult conversations that people tend to avoid, and we're gonna get into it. So we are here today with Juani Iris Manley. So great to have you here. Uh, not recording from, from France. You know, you're out and about doing your stuff, but super excited to talk about that move that you did do and how it kind of changed your life. Thank you so much. Thank you for having me, and thank you to your listeners. Yeah. Now I wanna start just a brief overview, if you could, of who you are, kind of what you're about. So I, um, I am an IP lawyer, and I'm also a speaker, and I actually speak on the power of change, of just really, um, you know, really helping companies and actually individuals understand that, you know, we've been taught to believe that change is external, but it really, you know, it's actually quite internal. Um, and that actually came from me doing my wild and crazy move of, you know, moving to Paris, just following signs, just actually moving there. And so I actually help companies to actually to navigate, um, through any kind of like change or disruption in their companies, and also deal with individuals that are actually trying to change their lives, that aren't quite understanding like, you know, why isn't things... Like, they want something to actually change but don't quite realize, okay, what actually needs to be, they need to do within themselves, um, so helping them actually kind of pull that out of themselves and to help them create the life they actually wanna be living that's reflective of that. Right. And now more than ever, companies needing to change to adapt to the newer generations to serve a different type of people with different types of beliefs, and, uh, that's just one of many changes, not just generationally, but talking about the technology side of things. Uh, being adapt- being able to adapt and change is really the difference between a company that survives and one that goes, uh, for lack of better words, extinct. You know? So I think that's really important. Uh, and then again, on that personal level, change. So we've mentioned multiple times your change, one that, uh, some, for lack of better words, might call radical, some might call crazy- some might say, "That sounds pretty fun." What kind of life were you living that you're suddenly like, "Let's move somewhere that I, that I don't speak the language." Had you ever even been there before? What kind of was the process of that? So for me, it really came down, it was New Year's Eve in 2010, and I was in Miami at the time. And I, you know, was... I had plans to go and party with my friends like I always do every New Year's Eve, and I just woke up that morning like I always do. Like, I just, I wake up quite early. I'm, I get into meditation, but I just made this abrupt decision to not to go out and party, but to actually stay at home and to, like, literally look at my life and to analyze what happened and to actually plan ahead for the next year. And the reason was for that was because I didn't have a great year. I had actually had just- Mm-hmm ... started my own law firm, like, not too far from that. I'd actually came out of a relationship. It was, like, my first time being in love. Coupled with, like, me being an entrepreneur for the very first time and not knowing how to run a business at the time, but only being, had a lawyer, really stifled, like, any chance for success. And so what I just... I just woke up that morning. I didn't feel like going out there and pretend like this is gonna be my year. Like, you know, the things that we all say, and it's like, literally like the next year- Mm-hmm ... looks like this, the next year. And I really wanted to break that pattern. And so I just began this whole organic process of meditation, of like literally getting a le- a legal pad out and writing out, like, okay, all the things that went, you know, what I achieved the first, you know, for that year, what I didn't achieve, like what went wrong, and, like, that list was much longer than the very first one. And then I just took radical self-responsibility. I just went through each one of them and was asking, said, "Okay, what really happened?" And long story shorter, there was, like I said, I was, like, in love for the very first time. Um, I didn't really have know how to run a business, and I just wasn't making any money at the time. And then, um, I had also was on a spiritual path, and I really could see that, you know, the results of my life was really reflecting what I was actually believing about myself, about my capabilities, like my limiting beliefs, things like that. And so I literally wrote down every single limiting belief that I believed about myself, and I was just being, like, super honest. And, um, I didn't hold back at all, and then when I was done, I just literally got on all fours. I prayed to God, and I was like, "Help me release and to let go of every single limiting belief, and then, like, let me see myself in the way that actually, like, you know, you see me." And that was the end of it. I kind of like a whole forgiveness thing because it was kind of like, you know, kind of feeling pretty yucky about after, like, you kinda just really go all out like that. And then the next part of the, um, the afternoon, I just spent, you know, every day, every New Year's Eve, I always get a brand-new journal. And this was typically when I just got, I have the word imagine on it. I just began to write everything I wanted to be, that I wanna do, and to have. And it was pretty, like, outrageous thinking. I always say, you know, looking back, I always, I feel like I was writing that day the way Elon Musk must think like because it was so outrageous. It was so, like, out there. There were no how am I gonna do it? How, where's the money gonna come from? It was just, like, I wanna do this, this, and this, and this, and this. Now, and then, like, I just began to j- you know, to, to visualize. And then when midnight came, I took one sip of champagne out of a glass, and I just passed out because I had been doing this since 6:00 that morning. And I'll share with you, like, you know, I, I never said that I wanted to leave by Mi- I wanted to leave Miami. But I was really, really desperate for a change. And so what ended up happening was, like, two days later, I just started getting all these signs about Paris, Paris, Paris, French this, French that. And my whole world in Miami was just like... You know, Miami is, like, pretty much... It's a little bit different now, but before when I was living there, it was the thing, we, we would call it, like, being Northern Cuba because, like, all Latinos, like Cubans, and, like, you know, South Americans. But it was like everywhere I went, it was always like, you know, everything was in French. And so, like, literally over the course of a year, I kept getting all these signs about Paris, Paris, Paris. And I ended up just selling my apartment. I sold my car. I gave away all my things to a friend, charities. And I just kept my legal files at a friend's, at a friend's house 'cause they're legal, I had to. And I moved to Paris not knowing a single person, not knowing, um, one word of French. I, I knew no one there. I didn't have any plan whatsoever, and that's how I ended up there. And I stayed. And how old were you at that time? Gosh, it was in my Jesus years, so it was like 33. It was like, it was like, uh, I was 33 when I did that. Okay. Yeah, so that's a pretty significant, uh, time in life to be making that kind of change, you know. And how long... You said that it's been quite a while now, so, uh, what kind of has kept you there? You know, there was never a calling for another change or, or moving. Like, what kind of has kept you there? You know, when I got there, more of myself began to be revealed, and what I mean by that is that, so I have been a lawyer for 22 plus years, but I've been groomed to be a lawyer since I was two years old, 'cause my father, my family's from West Africa, Liberia. My father's former minister of finance, and I've, I, even though I was born in the US, I've lived in both different countries. And so I grew up in a sense of like this like diplomatic household, like me being around heads of state and ambassadors, things like that. And so I was just kind of like that was the world that I grew up in, and so that was just like the projection for me. In sub-Saharan African culture, you're either a doctor, a lawyer, an engineer, you work for the government. Like, there is no, "I'm going to be a writer." It's not like here in American culture, you can kind of like explore type things. And so my whole life has been leading me towards being a lawyer, and so when I got there, um, I had kind of gone a spiritual path, you know, right before. But then like my creativity began to open up. Like, I began to write books about spirituality, about personal development, because it's what I was actually going through, and I just kind of like this whole creative spark. I also love the European lifestyle in terms of like walking everywhere. Um, it just suits me, and it was, it was also quite challenging as well too. And really for me at that point, there was no going back because there was no home to go back to. I had sold it. I'd gotten rid of every, I had got rid of, rid of everything. And also too was really this conviction within me was like, you know, I didn't go to Paris. Paris called me to it, and it was never in my, it was never even on my radar. So like, I wasn't like your typical American, like all cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs about Paris and sort of France in general. And so it was just so bizarre why I was even there in the first place. I mean, had it been Italy, which I had lived in Italy before, went to school there, and I wanted to live in Italy, you know, it would just made sense. But France made no sense whatsoever. But there was just things that just began to started happening to me. I was like, okay, this is much more bigger than myself. Let me just see where this is actually going to go. Now, were you able to, uh, maintain lawyership in France? 'Cause I'm not sure how that works with degrees across countries and, and then having to learn a language or maybe you were an English lawyer. How does that work? Well, I was so ... I, I've always been a transaction lawyer, like, for the most part. When I first started I was in litigation, but so when I moved to Paris, at the time I was doing IP corporate and securities work. Eventually I could no longer keep that going because as a securities lawyer, like, there it required me to be in the US for a certain amount of days and so while I was in the process of like, you know, getting like long-stay visas, things like that, I had to remain in the country. I had to like let that go. And then also too, like, before that actually even happened was like, I mean, at that time I had like really five clients, which are like my bread and butter, like dream clients, meaning like, I mean, one client, for example, it was like these are all publicly traded companies. Like, the CEO would just like wire money to my, the company's like, you know, operating account, and he would send me an email and say, "Hey, Wani, we need X, Y, and Z done. We've already sent you a payment. If it's not enough, call John and ask him for what else- whatever else you need." It was clients like that, you know? And so what ended up happening was like when I got to Paris, um, I had a LinkedIn profile, but it was just, I hadn't, I hadn't looked for a job in so long, but it was just kind of like a bare bones. But then in Paris, get an apartment there is like get an MBA. And so I actually had to go up into my LinkedIn and I had to like, I had to like really invest in like, you know, creating a r- real profile, and he was connected to it. And so I was writing, I was posting about me writing books, about me being in Paris, and he actually just wrote to me. He's like, "You know what, Wani? I've actually have lived in Paris when I was quite young. I was your age, and we just prefer to actually have a securities lawyer that's just practicing securities law. Enjoy your time in Paris. Go and explore." And so that was my first client to let me go. And then like the next one, um, they just decided to go out of business. And then the other three that I actually had, the Ebola thing, that's when the Ebola thing came out in like bigger, and they actually put out like, they put out a, a press confer- a press release without me going, without it being sent to me, and actually like the SEC actually flagged it because whenever like it's a natural disaster, there's a whole bunch of scams, right? And so anyone kind of putting out a kind of, uh, you know, feelers out there, alerts out there, the SEC tags it. And so like their loss ability actually trades, so there was just signs of like I was supposed to be doing something else besides practicing law. Mm-hmm. I didn't know what it was, but it was just being removed from me, in a sense is what I'm saying. And so then, um, what ended up happening was that I ended up started speaking. Which was basically it came about where when I got there, I got into a bunch of like, I'm sure you found the same thing in Japan, you just join a bunch of expat groups, right? To, to kinda like get to know people. And there was this one called Expat in, Expat in Paris, but it was also a magazine that was actually placed throughout like, you know, Starbuckses, at universities, at, you know, at, um, embassies. And so the, um, the editor had made a post on, in the group and he's like, "Hey, I'm looking for really like interesting stories about people moving to Paris away from the, 'I followed my spouse,' you know, 'I've been living in Paris,' da, da, da." And I just, I saw it and I said, "Hey Kevin," I said, "I just had this, you know, article written about me in New York." I just sent it to him, the link to it. And he goes, "Oh my God." He goes, "Can you reduce this in, you know, to 600 words and give it to me in 24 hours?" Now ask a lawyer to like, you know, to... 'cause we're very verbose, we just actually have to be just like our training. And so I sat up like all night and had a friend, uh, in like New Zealand actually helping another lawyer to condense it. We sent it to him because he wanted to publish it in an article in the, in the, the next month edition, December edition. And so I was in an article. People begin to recognize me as the woman from Miami with bald head that moved to Paris just following signs. And people just started asking me, "Hey, can you come speak at my event?" And so that's when I started my speaking career. I started, you know, speaking in Paris and that's how I became a speaker Wow. Yeah, I mean, everything kind of just lined up and fell into place beautifully, and I think that's amazing, and confirmation of, you know, the calling that you had there that you leaned into and answered. And I think a lot of us are afraid to answer that calling because it usually is to somewhere or something that we didn't expect at all. You know, it's very blindsiding. Now, when you talk about speaking, what did you really like to focus on, and, you know, what kind of has evolved from that initial message to what you do now? Well, initially it was, so I wrote a book called Get Out of Survival Mode and Live the Life That You Really Want, and it's all about, um, the, the limiting beliefs that we have or the paths that we take in life that sets us up for life of struggle rather than living for a life of, like, true joy and just living out a life that we actually care for. For example, like, the first one is, okay, there's a lack of self-love. Like, I mean, for example, like, when I was growing up, and I've taught, I've always asked this question, no one ever taught me to love myself. We were always told that love was something you got from, like, your parents, from your, your siblings, your schools, things like that. So, you know, when you don't love yourself, you're always going to be seeking, like, validation. You're gonna be a people pleaser. So, you know, it just kind of talked about the different things, like, okay, following a path, like, to, to please your parents, you know, to make them proud type thing. And so I started speaking, and people... And I had just published a book, and so initially it was about my book, and it was about actually living a life that you really want, and people were just very interested about my journey, about how the hell did I just actually, like, let go of everything, because they were following social media as well too, so initially it was about that. And I'll tell you, when I was there, I had no idea what I was supposed to be doing because the whole thing was, how am I supposed to make money doing this? Because when you're writing a book, it's very isolating. You know what I mean? Mm. It's like, I didn't have a, I didn't, I didn't have a, I, I wasn't shopping for an, a big publisher, and so, um, I really had to trust it. You know what I mean? I had to trust, okay, there was something else kind of, like, guiding this life, and it really didn't all come together for me until actually I did the TEDx. And the TEDx talk was about this whole thing about how I, like, sp- ex- explained to you about the New Year's Eve and, and moving to Paris, and I just realized, oh my God, this journey was about change, and looking about my entire life, it's always been about that. Because I thought where change has become very difficult for most people, for me it hasn't. I actually love it, and I actually ask for it. And so, you know, it was like, and I realized, okay, the change that comes, it's internal. So the, the TED t- the TED Talk is Change and Changes Everything. And so that's my framework, which is what I work through with, whether you're a company or an individual, and so that's what it's actually evolved to right now, what I speak about. So would you say that your particular focus is on the benefits of change or the best strategies for change? Or what is your main takeaway for everyone? It's more the power of change, because, you know, change gets a bad rap, you know. Like, if you- Mm. You know, the minute, like, anytime, like, getting cha- everybody fears change. I mean, it's, it's literally rank- ranked up there with, like, the fear of death, you know. It's like people don't actually move towards it, they actually move away from it. And I'm like, first of all, we've been changing our entire lives. It's like none of us are the same. I mean, even, like, you slept last night, I slept last night, we're not the same persons who we were yesterday. So this idea that, this, this notion that change is very difficult, it's a lie. It's just, it's actually like a fallacy. And so the first, the first premise is, let's divorce ourselves from the universal mantra that change is actually hard. Because the more you tell yourself something is difficult and it's hard, your subconscious mind or your mind isn't going to lead you to action to follow it. So number one, let's just drop the negativity around it, because there's so much power in change. Because number one, I would not be having this conversation with you had I not said yes to change, because my whole life I thought I was just gonna be a lawyer, you know- Mm ... drafting contracts and, you know, and, and, and doing IP work. I never thought I would be on stage speaking in front of thousands of people and, you know, doing like a TEDx Talk and preparing for a second things like that. So as for me, it's opened up so many doors because there, there's, with every change, there are so many more door opportunities. But I mean, it, it goes hand in, whenever there's something change, by definition you are gonna be losing something, you know. But we're so caught up in what we're losing or letting go, what's being removed from us, we aren't really realizing, oh my God, it's for a bigger cause, it's for something much greater for ourselves. So my work is really getting people to focus on that, rather than looking at the perceived closed doors behind you. For sure. I think a lot of change fears actually relate to one of the biggest fears, which is fear of the unknown. And a lot of people- Yeah ... fear change because, uh, it can be very unknown if you don't have a strategy or if it's unexpected. And we have seen historically that, uh, the older people get, usually, uh, the more they resist change. But I think it can work the opposite way, where the more you embrace it, the easier it becomes, as, as you mentioned. And I think change is really important, and it can go down to a single conversation even. You know, I've had, uh, the decision to start a podcast, which- Yeah ... going full time with that, I didn't know what it was gonna entail. That, for me, was also a spiritual journey where I told God, I said, "Listen, I've been invited to a podcasting conference." I didn't even know they did those. I didn't know podcasting was, like, that, you know, popular. Uh, if you want this to be something bigger and, and full time, I'll, I'll embrace that change, but you need to tell me. And, you know, I got selected. Someone else paid for me to go to this conference, and since then it's completely evolved into being an international speaker and comedian performing on stage and speaking on stage in different countries at different events, to recording with people around the world. And so it's... I think back sometimes, what if I had just said, "No, I'm not going," like, because I had never been on a solo journey where I traveled- Mm-hmm ... out of state alone. I had never been to a conference, let alone one with 3,000 people. Uh, you know, so all of that was nerve-wracking. Uh, but I look back and my whole life would've been different, right? I mean, we all have that moment, and I think there's something worse than fear of change, and for me that is bitter regret. Mm-hmm. The regret and the what ifs. Yeah. Uh, I think the scarier what ifs aren't, you know, what if I do this and this happens? I think the scary regret is, what if I had done that, you know? Yeah. Uh, I think that's, that's the worst part, and I'm sure you can speak to that to some degree. Because I'm sure you would've lived the rest of your life, what if I had gone to Paris and, and I didn't? And you're sitting in some office on a computer every single day. You're like, "What if I could've been at a cafe right now?" You know? That's probably what you were thinking, like, at the cafe, 'cause I, I assume Paris has some really good cafes from what I've heard. So yeah. And I, I think speaking isn't something a lot of us plan to go into. It kind of just unfolds. And I know i- if you want to speak to, actually, have you ever wrestled with imposter syndrome, feeling like me, a speaker, am I qualified to speak on this? Is my message good enough? Am I good enough? Have you wrestled with any insecurities or doubt or imposter syndrome? No, you know what? For me, it, I have not because I speak about what I already know, what I've, what I've actually have lived. You know, I, 'cause I also speak about the law as well too, but for me it's, it's come down to more of getting, like wrestling with getting paid to do it. Yeah. Yeah. Like, you know what I'm talking, you gonna pay me like, you know, thousands of dollars, like just to talk about my life, like just to talk about what I did and what I've gone through? You know what I mean? Like for me, because I, there's also the, the strong identity of a regulated profession as an attorney and then like that's like specialized knowledge and it's like, my God, I can actually probably make more money, you know, doing this and it's just so easy. And it's like, so it's just like for me, that's been more of like the, the struggle with that. Um, and also too, like just kind of, and also too, like letting go completely of the legal identity. You know what I mean? Because it's like, like I said, I've been, I've been groomed since I was two years old to be, you know, to do that. And so for me it's, it's, it's been more of that, um, than r- than anything else. Yeah. I totally get that. In fact, I have been scolded for being a does too many things for free kinda guy. But for me, there were so many things that I was like, "But this is not specialized or secret knowledge." But I guess what people really confronted me about was like, "But Mr. Wishey, it kind of is because people are asking you these questions, they're viewing you as the expert because they don't have this knowledge or expertise, uh, because they just haven't lived those experiences or done what it is, whether it's podcasting or whatever other subject." And I'm like, "Hmm, it's, it's interesting to think that life experience is specialized knowledge." But at the same time I'm a huge proponent of that because I have been wrestling with a lot of the speaking industry in terms of suicide prevention and awareness, because a lot of events have gate kept me saying, "You're not a licensed clinician or doctor." But I said, "I've s- personally stopped a suicide homicide plan in the military. I've stopped several suicides in the military and afterward, and I have been top of the charts podcast for suicide prevention and awareness." And I said, "You know, I understand the value of the clinical and psychological study side of it, but I can guarantee you I've probably stopped more suicides than these people who went to college and read a book about it." I've actually sat down and had the conversations. I've had to use physical force, verbal conversations in some situations that these textbooks aren't talking about, because I guarantee you none of those textbooks were talking about, "Hey, we've been on a submarine for 12 hours and this guy's losing his mind." I mean, this is real stuff. And I, so I'm a huge proponent of lived experience is specialized knowledge, uh, when you really master and spend time with it and develop it into something more than just a passing moment. So I, I agree with that, but I've also had that guilt of like, I don't wanna pay to talk about stopping suicides. Like that's, you know, that's a n- a noble mission that I have. Um- Yeah ... but people, you know, have kinda slapped me on the wrist about, "Well, who's gonna feed you?" And I'm like, "This is true." Yeah. I, I do, I- I am glad to be in Japan where it's a lot cheaper to eat, and I'm g- I'm kinda- Yeah. Yeah. Whoof. But, uh, it, it is im- important and, you know, I think specialized knowledge versus lived experience is a huge thing, and there are a lot of people who haven't gone through what you've gone through. In fact, there are more people who have denied the call than answered it, and I think it's important to have those who have answered it give reassurance to people because that inspiration is important to the degree that some people really just need to see that someone else did it successfully, and that'll- Yeah be their safety net. Some people can't just jump into the unknown. You know, some people prefer, like, all right, I wanna maybe not copy some kinda template, but if it's been done successfully before, the chances of it failing me or X, Y, Z, people weigh the numbers and stuff. So I, I think that's really important. Looking at the future, obviously you're guesting on podcasts, you're accomplished author and speaker. What is the future looking like as you continue to develop this career and lifestyle? Well, for sure. Um, I- e- eventually the law, the law thing was just, it's something I don't do anymore. Um, I'm doing less and less of that, um, because I just, like, that's the calling and the, you know, that the path is actually speaking, um, you know, completely doing it and, and doing corporate training. But also too, um, there's definitely more books. I've got four more books inside of me. It's just a matter of finding time. Um- Yeah, yeah ... and then also too, um, there is a podcast where I, you know, I've been wanting to, but it's just like, it's more of like, what's the angle that I'm actually gonna take from it in terms of like, you know, really from a business perspective. And so, um, yeah, and just continue what I'm doing because I do- it's very, very impactful. You know, speaking of podcasting, um, one of the things I've, I've actually finding, you talk about influencing other people, is that I have actually found that in podcasting it's becoming more and more clear the people that I'm actually meant to help is, are people that are like myself, that is coming from like in the corporate world or in these- Mm regulated professions that have so much invested into our education. You know what I mean? And so, and, and it's like life is calling us to do something completely different, but again, it's like there's that fear of identity loss. Like, "Okay, who would I be if I'm not a lawyer? Who would I be if I'm not a doctor?" Or that's that CEO that's just tired of like doing whatever they're doing, right? They wanna do, I don't know, like be a fisherman or something like that, but they can't give up the, the stock options, but they're miserable and things like that. And so, yeah, if I can do it, you know, like being a securities lawyer, you know, and, you know, doing like high-powered money law, and go to Paris and start from completely scratch and lose everything, or lose all of my bread and butter clients, and here I am in, up on a TEDx stage, it's like maybe you can do it too. So, um, yeah, it's just like the impact is just coming for- more because I think, you know, it's always been like following a path that'll make, to pay the bills or to, you know, give you a career, but it's like literally found, like I have found like, wait, I can actually like enjoy what I'm actually doing. You know what I mean? I mean, even when I transformed my law practice to make it to where, okay, let me just do the type of law that I wanna do, but even more so being on stage or talking to people or writing books or podcasts, it's just, you just feel that you made an impact. When someone says to you, "Oh my God," like, you know, "I heard you," and it's just like, "I did this because of what you said," or, "You helped me," or, "You helped me lead me the way." The same thing for you. I'm sure you get those, you know, you get those res- you know, emails from people as well too, right? Yeah. Yeah. And I think, w- I think I really wanna re-harp what you said about the r- the r- re-pivot from an identity that you put so much time and money into is so difficult. Because- Yeah ... I always think about that too. Like, there's so many people I know who are doing something completely different from their degree, a degree that they put time and money into. You know, I know YouTubers who have full-on engineering degrees. I know, uh, one of the people I've interviewed on this show actually, like, Tien Wong was a full-time engineer, and she quit that to be, uh, specifically a female fitness, uh, influencer and coach helping women achieve the hourglass body shape. And, you know- Mm-hmm ... speaking of that in, like, especially in her culture in Malaysia, to leave engineering to do fitness as a woman, like, that was a huge, huge, like... She still hasn't told her mom. I hope her mom doesn't find this episode. But, you know, um, that, I mean, it's just, it can be so scary. And I, you know, I've had the same thing myself too, like, went from nuclear operator and, and, you know, even some of my blue collar job after that working at chemical plants to be a podcaster, you know? But I think- Yeah ... some of it too isn't... In my case, and I, and this is why I kind of relate to you in that sense, my parents pushed for the military my entire life. I didn't wanna do it. When I was 17 years old, they basically said, "You're doing this," and that was my life path. So sometimes I don't feel bad. I know how much time and money went into it. I know how much other people would love to have had that opportunity. Uh, but I always felt from a young age, I used to dream about being a YouTuber or talking on stage or stuff, and I was like, "Well, I doubt that'll ever happen." And now I look back, I'm like, "I can't believe it." And it's like- Sometimes the, the identity we're grieving wasn't our identity to begin with. It was the one- Yes ... that we got because the world said it was more effective, or our parents pushed it onto us, or whatever. And I think- Okay. ... you know, we need to answer that real... Or yeah, or, uh, or most importantly, it's, it's safe. You know, a lot of these entrepreneurial routes, they're, they are risky. Yeah. But we also know you can't get by in life just, well, you can get by in life just playing it safe, but you can't fully live without taking risks, you know? And that risk can be change. That changes everything. Yeah. So. Yeah. You, you can't live a f- you cannot live a fully expressed life. And so at some point it catches up with you. It's the, the, you know, the, the midlife crisis, you know, and things like that. And so God, universe is kinda like, puts like a monkey wrench and kind of engage you on the right path, so. Yeah. And I think it's important. I, I actually like what, uh, John A. T. hosts a Refuge Freedom Stories podcast says. He's like, "God will put a pebble in your path to see how you deal with it, and then a rock, and then- Yeah a stone, and then a boulder." You know, it is a progression. And definitely, you know, keep us up to date on those other books. I am the same boat as you, as, like, so many books inside but so much t- only so much time to write, you know. I'm typing into my phone notes on airplanes, and I hate having to write on my phone because that keyboard is so much faster. But yeah. Yeah. I think, you know, it's, it's great. So, oh, we'll definitely have you back on when those books are out to talk about those and the change that they're gonna make in people's lives. And of course, you know, by then I'm sure you'll have spoken at many more places and gotten some more global experience, which is one of the most amazing parts about podcasting and traveling, is I always emphasize the global and intercultural exchange, you know. Who would've thought that going to Paris would mean you'd end up in Texas or somewhere else in the US- ... at some other point in time, right? You're like, am I- Yeah ... I'm not going to Paris to go to Texas, but that's- ... how it kinda looped around, uh, to some degree. So I, I think- Mm ... that's amazing. And then I wanna mention as well, we're gonna have your website in the description below, where there's a whole ton of stuff, speaking, training, strategic advisory, uh, books, and then your contact information. So a ton of stuff for people to check out if they wanna know more about you and your story, which obviously there's a whole bunch to. Uh, but I wanna thank you for your time today guesting, and I just wanna encourage everyone to think about change right now. Not just the changes you wanna make, but maybe the changes that are calling to you that you've been pushing off, neglecting, or that you didn't realize were there. Thank you for having me and I would love to be back on again