Embodying Reality Into Fiction: Trapped In Deception By Ken Webb

Today, I sit down with Ken Webb — retired U.S. Army Lieutenant Colonel, former American Airlines professional, and now debut author of Trapped in Deception. Mr. Webb brings a lifetime of service, travel, and life lessons into a conversation that blends military experience, civilian transitions, and the art of turning real-life betrayal into a gripping novel.

We explore Mr. Webb’s 33 years in the Army Reserves, including 18 years of active duty spread across deployments, military police work, and military intelligence. He shares how balancing civilian and military careers shaped his resilience, perspective, and ability to adapt — and why he believes the Reserves can be a rewarding path for the right person. We also discuss his time living abroad in Peru, learning Spanish, and setting new personal goals after retirement.

We get into his upcoming novel, Trapped in Deception,  inspired by real people and experiences. Mr. Webb explains how betrayal from a once-close friend became the foundation for a story about trust, manipulation, and the power of forgiveness. Along the way, he offers insights on letting go of resentment, writing with purpose, and finishing the creative projects most people never start. Whether you’re a veteran, an aspiring writer, or someone navigating life after a major transition, this episode has lessons on resilience, discipline, and living with intention.

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Transcript

 Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to another episode of Couple of Nukes. As always, I'm your host, Mr. Whiskey, and how many of you feel right now or have ever felt trapped in deception? And that is a reference to a novel we're gonna be talking about today, courtesy of Ken Webb. And we're gonna talk about.

Fiction reality blending the two. And how many of us have dealt with betrayals, with lies, with hardships, especially those of us who have served in the military. Those of us transitioning to the civilian world, and also just those of us who have been born and raised in civilian world. We're gonna get into it.

If I said, Mr. Kenneth Webb, great to have you here, and could you please give us a little introduction for, for yourself? Yeah. Hi, uh, I, I'm Ken Webb. Thanks for having me on the show, Mr. Whiskey. Uh, I was born in Dale, Pennsylvania, outside Philadelphia, uh, February the 18th, 1969. I'm 56 years old. I grew up in Pennsylvania, New Jersey, and Texas.

Uh, always wanted to be in the military from a young age, was never really sure what I was gonna do. Uh, graduated from high school in Grapevine, Texas. Went to junior college. Saw a guy there wearing ROTC uniform at the junior college 'cause he was going to the large university. Asked him what that was all about, got involved with it.

Got a scholarship. Uh, the Army paid for my bachelor's degree. Uh, graduated was a second lieutenant. I was enlisted first three years while I was in the reserves. Graduated was a second lieutenant in the Army. I started out in tanks, enlisted, then I went military police, 14 years, transitioned to military intelligence for 16 years.

So I have a total of 33 years in the army. Always as a reservist, but with about 18 years of active duty in places all over the world, did a lot of fun things. Uh, also worked as a teacher for two years during that time at a high school. Uh, worked in business, uh, with a friend, uh, worked uh, in a little bit of technical writing.

Uh, worked in the airlines and reservations, and then operations. I did retire from American Airlines, and then I retired as a Lieutenant colonel in the Army, and I did a Department of Defense contracting for seven months in Kuwait. And I came down here to Peru. This is my fifth time down here, but on my fourth time, I was here for a year and I studied Spanish before my mother got sick and died, and I had to go back and so I, I, I was back up in, in Texas for, for nine months, taking care of things.

Then I returned here. I'm, I'm happy down here writing that first book that you see above my head up there. Traffic Deception, you can't Miss it. And then my, my name, that's my website, the ken web 60 nine.com. I'm doing this, I'm getting fluent in Spanish because it's a necessity here. People may tell you they speak English, they really don't.

You need to learn their language and, uh, I'm, I'm preparing. I wanna get my doctorate online through American Military University. I'm, I'm just preparing for those things. I'm, I'm excited about the book. Uh, I didn't write it for money. I wrote it 'cause I have a story to tell everybody in the book who speaks.

Every speaking person in the book is based on somebody I really know and I, it's with the editor right now and I should be getting it back the 4th of September and publishing it in December. I'm very happy about it. So why did you go the reservist route and not go straight into the military? Was it kind of that idea of, hey, I wanna live a civilian life and a military life, or what kind of influenced that?

Well, uh, you know how sometimes we just kind of trip into things and it's, it turns out to be the best thing. Yeah. That case, that has happened a lot. Uh, okay. So I started out, I wanted to be active duty. But when I went to school, I didn't play the game for my bachelor's degree. I didn't maybe play the game is, is a little bit too strict, but I didn't, uh, study and do things in order to get good grades.

I worked hard and wanted to learn things, which is really what school is supposed to be about. But, uh, my grades weren't so high. Now during my master's degree, I went back 20 years later and got a master's degree and I was on, I graduated with honors. But for my bachelor's, my grades weren't so hot. I wanted to be military intelligence, not military police.

My grades weren't good enough and I got a degree in English literature and I wasn't selected, I believe, 'cause my grades weren't good enough. I was commissioned in 1992. It was after the Gulf War, and they were cutting back. As a matter of fact, I was only able to get commissioned as a second lieutenant because I was scholarship.

If I wasn't scholarship, I wouldn't have got in. So it was, it shows me that way. I was very disappointed at the time, but it, it turned out to be a good thing. Uh, and I mean, later on I transitioned to military intelligence. But I'm glad I went military police first because I learned a lot of things and a lot of the tours I got and jobs I got was due to a background in military police.

And it was the same way when I retired. When you say, why did you retire as a lieutenant colonel? Well, I could say, well, I, I had achieved everything I wanted to do. I wanted to get out. No, I, I didn't make colonel. That's what happened. I didn't get selected. And, and you know, you, you, you run a race, somebody wins the race.

That's all I believe. It's not, no. We all run the race. No, we didn't. Somebody won it. So I'm not gonna say I got anything unfair given to me. They do a selection process and I wasn't selected for colonel. Some other people were. It's as simple as that. Uh, it's very hard to make Colonel, and I think it's getting harder to be fair to the people who are in now and who were in before me.

Uh, there was a time in the nineties where it was very hard to make major, even in the reserves. And after nine 11 and the height of the, you know, wars going on two wars, they, you know, I mean they were just throwing money at people. Contractors were making ridiculous money and that really did need to stop.

And it did. I mean, I, I feel for the contractors, but we were spending a lot of money on that. So it was the same way when I retired, you know, there's only so many years you could be commissioned and then you have to get out. It was 28 for me and then I retired and then three days later I got a letter in the mail.

'cause it was during COVID and it, it said so much of your retirement now I've given, was given another two years. In order to make Colonel, I still didn't make it, but I did do a tour at the embassy in Baghdad, Iraq, and then when I was retired again, I, I felt a little bit of depression. Then I realized now that I'm retired, I have a pension.

I can do the things I wanted to do. That's why, I mean, I didn't have the luxury of writing a book and saying I don't care about money and when I was not retired, so, yeah. So I just want to clarify, when you say you did 18 years active duty, is that not 18 consecutive years, but a total of 18 years across all the tours you picked up?

You are exactly correct. It's the 18 consecutive years. Uh, I was reserves, uh, for three years. I got commissioned in 1992. I went to the Officer basic course. Now it's called Basic Officer Leader Course. It might be called something else now. Uh, yeah. And that was like a, a five month thing. And that was the only active duty I saw, except for the.

The two weeks in the summer, sometimes I get two, two week things, and that continued up until on nine. It was actually 2001 prior to nine 11, I went to Kosovo. I was in Bris Kosovo on nine 11 at a force protection meeting. And you know, we went to force protection condition. Delta went back to the base and yeah, everything was hectic.

After that time, the purse strings opened up and other tours just popped up, Hey, do you wanna do this? Do you wanna do this? Do you wanna do this? Because I was already in the process of going military intelligence. So at, at least at that time, if you were not in certain jobs as an officer, you didn't have a top secret clearance.

But I was in the process and already I, I, I had it. And so I could jump in even before I got, uh, fully, you know. Educated into the mil. I've, I translated over military intelligence a few years after that, but it, it took a few years and, uh, yeah, so you're exactly right. There were, I'd have breaks or two or three years, I'd go back to American Airlines.

I have a break for a year. I started out my company command when we were in Iraq the first time I was a battle captain under the S3, the operations officer, and then. Uh, the company commander had to leave theater and of course our battalion commander had to select from the captains who were there. And there were a few of us who hadn't had command.

And I got selected and so I started the command on active duty and then came back and did another two years as a reserve, uh, company commander. Dedicating one, uh, at least one day a week for God and country. 'cause I made sure I got days off from American Airlines that were during the week so I could come into the reserve unit, take care.

And there's so much admin stuff and, uh, for sure it's, you really have to love it. If you're gonna stay in the reserves and you're an officer, you're gonna figure out real quick that if you're doing it for money, it's, you're in a losing proposition. I mean. So were your civilian jobs very accommodating of your reservist schedule or was it kind of a headache?

Well, the only time I was mobilizing I was with American Airlines, so that was the only job and they were extremely accommodating. Now, I have been told, and I did not experience this, but I have been told. So this is just hearsay, right? That they were so accommodating is that during Desert Storm, uh, they had a lot of pilots who were also reservists, uh, who went and served in, in Desert Storm.

They came back by law. They had to give them a job, so they still had a job. But, you know, pilots often, uh, compete for routes and stuff like that, and they came back and they got kind of the, the bad routes and, you know, things like that. And, uh, you still have seniority, but you wouldn't get routes you would've normally had.

Mm. What it might be. And so I'm told they, they sued American Airlines that I can't confirm that. But I can tell you that American Airlines never gave me any hassle. They had a five year limit on what you could, uh, be away from the job under military orders. They changed that and they said, as long as we have troops deployed.

Uh, we're gonna allow them to do this. Well, heck, we still have troops deployed. So I mean, we're talking 20 over 24 years. I mean, we're almost 24 years. Interesting because, so you mentioned if you're in it for the money, don't do it. But if you love it, do it. Would you recommend that people do this reservist?

Civilian balanced life, or would you say it's really for, you know, a few who are really cut out for that kind of stuff? Or would you say it's really beneficial to every civilian to spend a bit bit of time in the reserves where they're getting some of the military life, some of the benefits, but not all of it?

Or how would you rate it? Okay. In short, I think I, I still feel it should be a volunteer army because of people. Don't want to be in there. We don't want them in there. At the same time, of course, I, I also feel it. Everybody should do it, but I don't think we should force them to do it. Okay. So, I mean, I have my religious beliefs, I have my political beliefs.

I think everybody should have the same, but I don't think they should be forced to have the same. But the reason I, I, I feel this way is that the benefits are really good. And, uh, as far as educational benefits, this, uh. Uh, post nine 11 GI Bill, I mean, I, I paid for my master's degree with tuition assistance, which you, you know, I used on active duty.

Uh, for a while it went away. It was only like a two month period and I used some of my GI Bill. I should not have, but I did. I I should have just paid outta my pocket. But that post nine 11 GI bill is great and I plan on using it for my doctorate and, uh. There's that, there's the pension. Uh, you still, I I, I, we have to ask somebody who's in right now.

Uh, I, I, I also know that people who only want to do like less time in the military, now they have something that's kind of like a 401k plan, kind of like businesses do, and they could still get something. I think it's at age 60, so it used to not be that. It used to be you go in 19 years active duty. You, uh, you get out, you don't get a retirement unless it's a medical retirement.

And it also used to be for reservist that they retired at 60 years of age. Now it's still that, except in 2008, uh, George Bush Jr. Put something in effect that for every year deployed. As a reservist, not a a normal active duty person, but as a reservist, if you're deployed in support of a combat theater, you don't have to be at the combat theater.

You just have to be supporting it. Uh, you get a year taken off your retirement. So I, I, I mean, I, I retired at at 53, uh, so I've been retired three years and I've been receiving my pension. Some people will, will say, well, no, you can't get that till you're 55. Well, I've been getting it since I was 53. When I retired from the Army, I started getting it and it was, it had to be backdated 'cause it took a few months, but they gave me all my money.

They're good about that. So yeah, I would encourage everybody to do it. Don't wanna force 'em to do it. Uh, they don't. And there's so, such a diversity. I mean, you, you pick whether you wanna do Marines, army Air Force, uh, space Force, coast Guard, coast Guard's a good thing, by the way. I had a roommate over in Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, and they, I think they have a good deal.

Uh, they have a unique mission and, and they, you know, they enjoy it. So, and if, if I miss one of the branches, I apologize. But, uh, I think they're all, all good. Uh, it depends on what you want to do if you're, you're looking for something more technical. It, I, I think it's more, I, when I think technical. For some reason, I think Navy, a lot of people say Air Force, but I, I just tend to think Navy.

And then of course Navy has their pilots, army has their pilots, air Force has their pilots, obviously. But you, you need to really check out what you wanna do. Uh, I think standard of living is best in the Air Force. Uh, but then some people say, oh, but with the Army, the Army has the most money and they have the most money to send you to different locations.

I think if you wanna travel the world, I, I think it's the Army is the way to go. If you wanna have excellent living conditions, everything like that, I, I think the Air Force is a way to go. You know, uh, my cousin's son wants to be, uh, special Forces. He's in the National Guard. Uh, and so that, that's the route he wants to take.

Now he does want to be a, a, a citizen soldier, and he has no intention of staying in 20 years. He wants to be a Green Beret for a while, and then he wants to get out. So that, that's just his goal. The other, one of her sons was in a source special operations, air wing or air group or something like that.

And he was a, uh, helicopter pilot, not a pilot helicopter mechanic. And he did the math on Excel and he was gonna go the officer route and he checked out ROTC and what he'd have to go through and OCS and all that. He didn't think it was worth it financially for his goals. Mm. So his, his goals were, were mostly financial.

I think if, if the only goal is financial, you're, you're gonna fail because you're gonna get frustrated if, especially if you're an officer and you have to do things for free because, 'cause the other one who wants to be an officer told me, he told his National Guard unit, Hey, look guys, I don't even care about you during the week.

I mean, I just do my stuff on the weekend. And that's all. I'm here. Well, I don't know when I was in That was, that was the wrong answer. I mean, we would've meetings during the week. We didn't get paid for. Maybe the Army's changing. I don't know. I know I did a lot of things for God and country. I, I suspect he's gonna get out.

I suspect. But yeah, I, I think it's for everybody. Everybody I think you get like, uh, if you have any disability from the military, the va My, my experience with the va, they've been great. I hear the horror stories and stuff like that. Only thing I can say is, as far as I could tell, they fixed it. They, they fixed it, so, yeah.

No. And at what point, so obviously you had an extensive career, American Airlines Reserves, and then within the reserves, multiple different positions. At what point did the idea of the book come together, or was that purely afterward? It was afterwards because I was thinking about a book in my head and honestly I was down in Peru.

It was 2023 studying at the same language school that I go to now. And I was speaking to one of my professors, uh, Romeo. He's uh, half. Peruvian half, uh, Italian, his mother's Italian. And I, I had this like, I get real anal about some things. I was like, I, I wanna learn Spanish. I wanna learn French no more. I don't wanna learn French, but I wanna learn Spanish.

I wanna learn French. I wanna get my doctorate. I wanna write my book. His degree is in industrial engineering. You got a master's in the Netherlands in theoretical engineering, something like that. Philosophy of engineering, I don't know. Uh, and, uh, he, he said, okay, Ken, in Spanish, we're, we're conversing. And he said, do is your book about, uh, your, your doctorate or French or Spanish?

And I said, no. And he said, is it written in English? And he said, and I said, yes. And, uh, he said, so why are you waiting? Just start it. So I started it in August of 2023. I kept on it until, uh, June of 2024 when my mother got really sick, went back to the United States, didn't work on it at all for seven months, and now I'm completing it.

So I'm I, I, I tell people, I put in about a year and a half into it. And it's really a, a bucket list thing for me. You know, just something we want to do. You know, I, I ran a marathon when I was 25 years old, had no desire to run another one. Uh, and I, I went to an underwater hotel scuba diving, 'cause I'm a big scuba diver.

Uh, and the book is just something, if you look statistically, most people don't finish it. Same way with the doctorate. People talk to me like, okay, with your doctorate, Ken, you're, you're 56 years old, you're, you'll be 57 in February. What are you gonna do with a doctorate? And I was like, I, I don't know. Uh, eventually I wanna go back into the workforce in some way, whether it's writing books, uh, maybe I'll just do volunteering.

I wanna volunteer with a church. Uh, may, you know, maybe, I don't know. It's, it's just a, I I think I, I disagree with you. I asked somebody recently, you know what? You have some goals and he's down here with me. A little bit older than me and he said, I don't have goals, I just have interests. I'm retired. I, I don't, that's not the way I function.

I have goals now. I don't have children. I'm not married. If, if you, there's nothing wrong with having kids. It certainly, I mean, to survive the human race has to have children. Your goals can be. Helping your, your granddaughter turned into a, a fine human being. It could be making sure your, your grandkids are safe and that they get a good education.

Uh, I, I maybe when he says interest, he really means goals that he does have, and now I'm not as strict with the time, you know, the army, you have to, okay. If you want to promote, you must get this done. Okay? You have a physical fitness test, you must do this. I'm much more lenient on my time. I'm giving myself a break.

Taking time to, to see things, to think clearly. And, and so trapped in deception is, is just something, and, and the interesting thing about that novel, it's, it was therapeutic for me. I had a friend who was a good friend. We went to university together and he, he was just a habit. He wasn't a pathological liar, but he is a habitual liar, the most manipulative person I've ever met.

And he could act very sophisticated. And then otherwise, you know, other times he'd get drunk and he is like the big Lebowski. I mean, he would just, he would act absolutely silly and, and do silly things and play practical jokes. The same person who could be very sophisticated, he read the books on the New York Times readers list.

He wanted, he would go to eat, he would ask the waiter, where was that? Uh, fish caught. He's trying to impress his day. He, he's saying things that somebody sophisticated would say, oh, what, what's the year of this wine? He, he, before nine 11, uh, he, he got, uh, a cell phone number with an area code for San Francisco.

He lived in Minna, Nevada. He was on a dating site. He used to drive to San Francisco on the weekends and have these dates, have a hotel where he stayed at. They would think he lived in San Francisco. He wanted them to think he made good money. He was sophisticated and, and so it was just therapeutics. I've never met anybody so manipulative, and he was so good at it.

Now, he's a real estate agent. He was a school teacher for, he had his own business. He was a school teacher. Now he's a real estate agent and he's successful, but I had to break off all contact with him. I don't return his calls. I don't return his emails. I, I don't, you know. I keep him in an arm's length because he is so manipulative.

'cause he was a lot of fun to be around. But when the bad outweighs the good, it's just like in a relationship you can get two good people and any, you know, most, I won't say any, most ministers or priests will tell you being in love is not enough to get married. You, you need to. Think about finances. It's a big thing.

You need to be, you need to think about responsibilities. If the husband is, if the wife says, okay, I'm from this country and the husband has all financial responsibilities and the husband is from the United States, and he is like, okay, well I'm from the United States and in my state it's not necessarily 50 50, but you need to help.

And not all countries think that way. If, if, uh, a husband is like me and they don't care a lot about the different colors in the house and the furniture and all that, then if I had a wife, okay, we'll paint it whatever color you want, just not pink or red. Okay. And, and anything else. And, okay, you want that furniture?

We'll do that. And I'm, I'm real easy that way. I, I don't have a lot of patience, but I have a high degree of tolerance. So. Uh, trapped in deception is all about a person being deceived, being tricked by someone they trusted, because that's when it really hurts. And then having that same pain relieve through a, a period of catharsis.

And, uh, I won't give away the end of the book, but I mean the, the person goes through a lot of change. The good person in the book is based on me loosely. I'm not a computer expert. The bad person is based on my former friend. You know, just different people have influenced me. The book started out being 77,000 words.

Now it's less than 43,000, but it's a lot better. I put real emails in the book, real texts, and I just changed the name, but I eliminated a lot of them because although they were real, they didn't add to the story. When I read a book, I want it to be where like it keeps my action going. I, I, I, it's a crime drama.

Or a psychological thriller. It's Doug. I, you know, I'm a big fan of, uh, Jack Higgins, uh, John with Carey, uh, who was a real spy, by the way. Uh, you know, uh, not so much with the James Bond novels, the, in Fleming. I used to be more into action. Now I'm more into the drama. The Frederick Forsyth, uh, no, although, um.

I don't know. There are other ones on the tip of my tongue. Uh, Tom Clancy, I think he is a great writer. Uh, but he, his books get a little long and, and detail oriented even for me. And it, you know, have a, a list of books. You can't see them over on my left that are, you know, I buy them at, uh, book fairs down here and books, English books are much more expensive down here.

I'm gonna print out the books and sell them down here to book fair. At the church, I go to the Church of the Good Shepherd and Anglican Church and I'm just, you know, excited about that. And, uh, the, the, just the whole thing, the trap to me, I know the story is great. The quality of the book depends on how well I write it, which I'm not in the league of those writers I just named.

Because we know from experience that with writing, it's not like people who are. It is an art, but it's not like people who paint or, you know, Mozart, Beethoven, it's not musicians. Some of them at an extremely young age are excellent at their art with writing it. It's something where it takes practice and you know, in my first book, it's maybe my last book, but, uh, it's a story that needs to be told.

And when people say, well, why is your book this long? I was like, how, that's how long it took me to tell the story. I know that, uh, the Harry Potter novels, uh, the first one, it took six years to write. I don't know how much was going on with the author, you know, I know she had kids, so I don't, I don't that that throws a whole different dimension.

When you have kids, you have to take care of them, so goodness knows how busy she was. But, you know, I, I felt like there, there needs to come a point where you, you ended, I have a friend, he's now 81 years old. He has been, and I'm not joking, he has been working on his novel since he was 14 years old. And he says he goes in and makes changes to it on the computer.

And I said, man, you're, you're 81. You need to, at some point you need to pull the pin on that thing. Yeah. You need to get it done. So I'm, I'm pulling the pin on this. I have read novels from very good authors and I found minor grammatical mistakes in it. I have, I have found, not major, but I found things that, you know, could have been improved upon.

But the important thing is to get it out. So I would encourage anybody who wants to write a novel, please do it. You won't be sorry. I agree a hundred percent. Uh, same with podcasting or anything you do. A lot of people get caught up in the perfectionist, uh, almost endless cycle or loop of, you know, having, uh, as a published author myself, you know, I've.

Every time you go back and reread it, you'll end up editing or changing something. 'cause you just, you know, our minds never stop. And like you said, at some point Yes sir. At some point. Be my son. Thank you. I was gonna say at some point you have to just let it go, you know? Um, we're all our own worst critics and the thing is, um.

We'll never truly be happy with it because we can always add more, say, wait, this and that. And, um, you should definitely do that two or three times the first time around. But like you said, when it's been actual years of just always going back and, and changing, you know, you become your own worst enemy and, um.

So what would you say are some major takeaways from the book? I know it's a work of fiction blended with reality, and obviously it's for entertainment purposes, but there's also definitely lessons to be cultivated from it. So what are some things you say people could take away from it? From my novel itself or from writing?

From your novel itself? From my novel, I would say that you need to forgive people and you need to forgive them, not. For their sake, but for yours. Now I'm a Christian. You know, he'd also say, well, God tells you that. Yeah, but the thing is when you, you know, people have power over people. I know this from having a security clearance.

When you talk freely about something and they can't twist your arm, blackmail you with it, they lose their power. When, when you allow somebody, first of all, you are responsible for your own emotions. I have to be careful when I say that because that's not giving somebody a get out of jail, uh, free card to speak to me any way they want to.

Uh, I am responsible for my own emotions. They are responsible for the things they say they, you can have. Arguing is a good thing if it's done with rules and you're respectful. You don't need to call the other person stupid. You don't have to say, don't talk about this anymore. You're talking is what gets it out.

It's, it's a good thing. So in my novel, much like myself, the Eddie, who is the, uh, the, the protagonist, he didn't forgive Sean, who's the bad person? Now there's no point in the novel where. Uh, we just say, oh, Eddie forgives this person. But there is a point where he could have done something very violent to him, and he did not.

He controlled himself. So in, in essence, you have to let go. I'd say the important thing is to let go. 'cause you're only hurting yourself. You, you think. Now that's easy to say. I mean, somebody cuts me off in traffic. I don't have a car here, but somebody cuts me off in traffic. I get irritated. Yeah, I think it's normal.

What's bad is when you hold onto that for weeks, months, years, you know, you, you don't, sometimes you, you just have to, I get angry and I just get up and walk away. I come back, I'm okay. But, uh, you know, somebody who, in order for you to really be hurt by someone, you have to have, uh, trusted that person and this person was my friend.

And so. The adult thing, the good thing that I could have done is just simply say, you know what? He's not gonna hurt me anymore. Just like fishing. You cut bait. Okay, it's done. But I did it. I let it simmer inside me. I stayed angry and I, I, but I still could have written the novel without, you know, you say, oh, well that's what motivated you to drive the, uh, write the novel.

It still would've been catharsis to write the novel. I just needed to let him go because I also believe that. God will hold people accountable for what they do. I like what you said, I'll, I'll describe it as forgiveness is inaction as much as it can be action. You know, sometimes it's, what we don't do is the embodiment of forgiveness, not just what we do.

And I definitely love that. And I think one of the books that I'm a co-author of, and it's not published yet, it'll be coming out later this year though, uh, I was writing about forgiveness and what I wrote, one of the sections was actually about how people try to use my faith as. Their justification, so to speak, where they say, well, Mr.

Whiskey. You only forgive people because you know you're a follower of God and you believe in Jesus Christ and, and it's not about that even if I wasn't a religious person, right? Because there are atheists and agnostics and all kinds of people around the world who still forgive one another, right? It has nothing to do with faith.

Our faith calls us to be more forgiving and it harps on us to do so, but at the end of the day, it's our choice, right? God didn't make it a world where you have to forgive. It's still your choice to make. So whether you're of the faith or not, yes, it tells us to do it, but it doesn't tell us to do it as, as a command for, it's not for God's sake.

It's for, for our sake, you know, it, we're told to forgive because it's a, a good thing to do. Right? Because, and I think part of that is God knows what happens to people when they keep unforgiveness and resentment in their hearts. You know, we see, I mean, we see on the news all the time, what happens when people don't forgive?

It can lead to some very. Disgusting and disturbing events of violence of hate. So I think it is important. I really appreciate you saying it's, it's not just, it doesn't matter whether I'm a Christian or not, that's not why I'm choosing to forgive. Right. It's definitely a little voice in the back of the head sometimes, but at the end of the day, it's, it's our choice to make.

And then, yeah. So I think that's an interesting novel. I know you said it'll be coming out within the next few months here, so we're gonna have. The website, Ken Webb 60 nine.com in a description below for everyone to check out. So what can they find on the website right now? On the website right now? Uh, I have put in there, uh, they have the, the chance and, you know, go to the website and you can sign up.

You, I have three possible covers to the book. I wanna get people's opinion. Now. You win. Have a chance to win a free copy of the book. I'm gonna have a drawing. In December was originally gonna be August. Now I pushed it in December, and you don't have to pick the cover that I choose. You just have to pick one of them.

And you can get a free copy of the book. It's only gonna be one free copy and it won't be digital. It'll be, and you know, I'll pull it. My, my girlfriend will probably pull a name outta the hat. And, uh, I'll just, you know, the old scientific way of just putting, not really scientific, but putting everybody's here and then just pull one out.

I'll send it to them. Uh. Now, hopefully these people either be in the United States or Peru, but I, I don't think they'll be anywhere else. But the United States, uh, may complicate it a little if they're outside the United States, but I still need to, I will honor my word if they are outside the United States, I'll go ahead and pay for the shipping.

Uh, and inside there also, you have me. Reading, uh, chapters of the book and I forget what I got through, but I think it's like chapter 14 now. The chapters have changed since that time, but you're getting copies of the book, you're, you're getting to see what it is. Uh, there's also, I have some other readings and there have bible readings.

I have poetry readings. Uh, I have latest on the news. I have some of the podcast in there. I'll, I'll put the link to this podcast when you send it to me. I'll have the link to this podcast. I have the link to several other podcasts in there so people will see what's going on. Uh, just general updates. If you know, I, I pay for the website.

I pay for the upkeep of it. I imagine I'll keep it in the future if I have other novels. It'll also show up in there. But yeah. Awesome. Yeah. So that is in the description below for everyone to check out now, and we'll definitely have you on the show again closer to the launch of the book to celebrate and just do a little recap or at least a social media post.

But I'm excited for you, like you said. Um, it's, it's amazing having a book published. You know, like you said, most people in their life say they wanna do one and they don't, and it's really. It's a beautiful thing when you, you say you want to do it and you actually do it, and it's not easy. There are days of writer's block, there are days where you're frustrated where stuff isn't lining up, right?

There are days where you, you have passion and you want to write, and then everything outside of of writing says, Hey, you gotta come, give us attention today. So. It's not a easy journey and uh, I'm excited for you and yeah, ladies and gentlemen, be sure to go to that website, help us pick a book cover for Mr.

Webb here, and, uh, go ahead and enter that giveaway. See if you can get yourself a hard copy. So, but Mr. Webb, thank you for coming on the show today to, to share it and to tell your story and uh, I look forward to connecting with you again. Alright, thanks for having me.