Information, Interpretation, And Intensity: Emotional Intelligence And Control

Today, I'm talking with Dr. Greg Stewart, author, counselor, and coach, to discuss the fascinating concept behind his book I³ (I Cubed). 

Dr. Stewart unpacks the three I’s—Information, Interpretation, and Intensity—which serve as a framework for managing emotions and making better decisions. We discuss how people have micro and macro emotional goals, and how there are different paths to achieve those goals. Together, they explore how this method can help individuals build emotional intelligence, navigate conflicts, and foster healthier relationships.

The conversation delves deep into the societal challenges of emotional regulation, including the dangers of making rash judgments without all the facts, the growing influence of social media on self-worth, and the politicization of emotions. 

Dr. Stewart also shares powerful insights into how our mental models, insecurities, and past traumas influence the way we react to the world. They also discuss the increasing tendency for individuals to demand emotional conformity from others, rather than developing resilience and personal growth.

Bringing it all together, Dr. Stewart and I examine how faith, values, and self-awareness can provide a stronger foundation for handling life’s challenges. They discuss the importance of rationality, truth, and self-discipline in achieving emotional balance, while also emphasizing the role of grace and truth in personal and societal interactions.

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Transcript

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to another episode of Couple of Nukes. As always, I'm your host, Mr. Whiskey, and you know, the show is called Couple of Nukes because I was a nuclear operator, and originally it was meant to highlight the nuclear community, and I've been out of that community for a while, so Going on almost two years here, and so most days I don't feel like a nuclear operator, but with our guest today I got confirmation that I still am one because his book I Cubed I was listening to a couple different podcasts with him and a lot of the hosts were saying I three and I never even thought of that.

I immediately said I cubed so confirmation. I am still a nuclear operator I I just see everything mathematically so  I, you know, glad to have that, but like I said, I queued a 

book that we will be getting into. We're here with the author, who is also a counselor and a coach, Dr. Greg Stewart. Great to have you here. 

Great to have and be here, Mr. Whiskey, and thank you so much for calling it iCube because with that little superscript with the three that, I mean, if you know math, you know, it's iCube, not just i3. So thank you. That's awesome. You know, I honestly was genuinely surprised when I heard people call it i3, but I guess, you know, it's, um,  I guess some people aren't,  math is my least favorite subject, but it's at the forefront of my mind.

I was tempted to call it, His book, I to the power of three, and I was like, that's definitely not his intention at all.  So let's, let's get into that. Obviously I know that it's for an acronym. Could you break down the three I's for us? Sure. So I cubed, uh, came, you know, I've had that in using as a technique for gosh, 25 years now, and it's simply three I's information, interpretation, intensity. 

And the way I like to describe it, it's kind of like the, um, the Panama Canal. Speaking of, that's been in the news a lot lately. So  It's like when the first lock fills up, we can open the second lock and then so on. So the first lock is information. So the rule is that I actually used it with myself a lot, especially I was, I was a pastor for a number of years where people would come up to me and, you know, say, you know, say gospel or something.

And I'd say, well, until I have all the information, it's illegal for me to have any opinion, interpretation, and any intensity, you know, emotion until I have all the information. So that was really a great boundary I set on myself and other people. And imagine if our culture and our society applied. It's illegal for me to have any interpretation, any opinion, or any intensity until I have information.

So then the next one is intensity.  I'm sorry, with the interpretation, forgive me, so information interpretation. So interpretation is kind of like the critical thinking piece of it, where it's, when we get the information, you know, we naturally think, you know, negative, if it's causing us negative emotions.

So the, the key question is, is there any other way of looking at it? Right, so we have a very subjective, you know, kind of honestly just selfish self centered, we're human way of looking at something. But if we step back and say, is there any other way of looking at it? We're incorporating other people's or, you know, other viewpoints of.

The information other than just our own, it's, it's pulling in objective truth and it helps you look at things very objectively, but also it's okay to look at it subjectively  if it is true. So once you have like you have could have several and goodness, 3, sentences that coexist alongside each other about that information, right?

So after all that, then you can determine the amount of intensity, which is the amount of emotional energy I need to respond to this. Right? So it's really a process because it's, it's about keeping our emotional intensity at bay and not negating it. Right? Because there's a saying I have in my book is, um, basically nothing bothers me unless it should.

So the goal is not to feel nothing. The goal is to feel the right amount of negative energy.  So that's the i cubed process.  I want to go back to that first part you said, because that's really resonating with me, which is the information. And it's, you know, you said it should be illegal to interpret if you don't have all the information.

It just goes back to the age old adage, you know, there's two sides to every story, or every coin, however you want to say, you should always hear both sides first. And I think an example I'd like to give, because we're in a very political age now, unfortunately, you know, but we're at the point where people are committing suicide over politics, where family members are cutting one another off.

Politics have become destructive to our society. And the example I'd like to use, and I'm not You know, promoting, or sponsoring, or in favor of either news channel, necessarily. But it would be like, you have to watch Fox News and CNN before you open your mouth. You know, like, get both sides of the story.

Just to give an example of two news channels that are considered political opposites. And of course, there's hundreds of news channels out there, and you could, you know, spend forever looking for information. But to get those two mainstream sources And then make an opinion. I mean, that alone would, I think, change a lot of the landscape of politics and, you know, societal interactions.

But unfortunately, humans are rash creatures and, uh, we don't want to gather all the information. You know, we like to often think that that is all the information that's out there and it's simple. But the world is much more complex. And then, of course, interpretation.  And I want to move on to the intensity part, really, because you talk about that level of intensity is the most important part. 

On my show before, I want to throw back to an episode I did with Kimberly Spencer, where we actually talked about some interesting studies that showed that emotional intensity in children was also dependent  to some degree on their level of education. Whereas some children only had words to express 100 percent of emotional intensity or zero.

Whereas children who had language and words to express in between were much more in control of their emotions. And so, let's get into, you talk about not expressing zero, not always expressing 100, though there are time and places for that. Let's talk about, is there really an ideal or average emotional intensity Or it's depending on the situation, and if it's depending on the situation, what can we use and do to analyze how much energy and output we should have? 

Great question. So, so I have like three tenants, opening tenants that kind of, um, you know, set the stage for the emotions. The first one is that just frame emotions, energy, which, you know, it's easy for be able to make that transition. Cause I feel a lot of energy too low or too high of energy. So there's good energy and then negative, not bad, but negative energy that we use just to solve problems.

The second one is to have the right brand or type. of emotional energy, which is, you know, differentiating just simply won't get into it, but anxiety versus stress. People say they have anxiety when it's actually stress, but then had the right amount and I use the scale of kind of one to 10. Um, in that process, the most common thing is that we have.

Too much emotional energy. Okay, so I kind of use this analogy of, you know, behind us always is the house of our heart, right where our mind and emotions are. And we're standing on the front lawn and all these people are before us, the people that are triggering us and, you know, causing us now. If you call me a name or say something insulting on the scale of 1 to 10, really, how big of a deal is it?

I don't know, probably a 1 or 2, but my emotion is inflated to a 6, 7, or 8, okay? So really, it's the, the point of this book,  before we can analyze, before I figure out what the most appropriate response to you is, because again, the most appropriate response could be a 1 or a 10, based upon degree of threat.

Right. So I just had, you know, just had our first grandson born on Saturday. So I'm flying high and excited. Thank you So if my grandson grows up and he runs out into the street, well gee on a scale of one to ten How big of a deal is that? Well, it's based upon the level of threat So it really is situationally based and all it is it's not like you have to come up with a number It's just you just focus on how much, you know, the emotional energy I need to respond.

But when it comes to human relationships, that's the biggie of, and it's really based upon, you know, you figure out first, actually, the most effective, healthy, emotionally intelligent response to the person. And then that's what you, where you burn the energy. So it's not like you come up with a number, but in order to get there, The we first had to deal with the inflation there's three Major causes for the inflation.

The first cause is we believe a lie about the situation. Let's say for instance like, you know, uh, Mr. Whiskey doesn't like me or he meant to do that, right or I believe a lie about the situation It could be that you know, i'll never find a job. Well as soon as our frontal lobe states a huge lie, like I'll never get a job, our mental model just obeys and it produces a lot of emotions.

We have to make sure just like on the interpretation and the information that we are, we narrow it down to truth statements. We can't believe lies because lies will automatically inflate. That's always the first step is the replacement lies. Secondly, is  That when we have the inflation, we have to turn around and if we know there's an inflation, I have to walk into the house of our heart.

So number one, it's psychologically, if I'm burning energy only thinking about you,  right? So I exaggerated, I not only look at the thing you didn't invent or didn't do, but I also started evaluating your character and your motives, right? Worst of all, I'm saying that the solution to my emotion rests in you changing. 

Well, now, now I'm screwed, right? Because you have all the power,  right? So I have to turn around and walk into the house of my heart. And then on the first floor is the floor of insecurity. And that's what we all have to deal with. The insecurity is that something I don't like about myself that's true. But when you point it out, I try and get, I get defensive and I try and shield it.

So we have to walk into our negative emotions. And the key number three is that all negative emotion is exposing something in me.  So it sounds bad, but it actually gives us the power back. I have to first figure out what's being exposed to me because my insecurities aren't your issue to solve. They're my issue to solve, right?

That's the key. So I'm taking the power and control back from the environment and I determine because if it's an insecurity if it's true then I simply own it. The second reason for the inflation is Off the floor of insecurity, there's a door that leads into the basement, and in the basement is the machine of identity, value, and worth.

Okay? Right? So, like whenever you hear things like, you're taking it  too personally. When we take things personally, I guess I should point at myself and not you, right? So Greg,  sorry about that, I'm not applying my own book. So Greg, you're taking things too personally, it means that I'm letting it Impact my value and worth. 

Right now again, it still might be true, but it doesn't my weaknesses. Aren't my value and worth my value and worth are based in other things like my identity and facts about myself. And when I'm at my best, that's actually who I am. But it's when I take it personally, I'm letting it be. Decrease my value and worth and it shouldn't that's the that's the second reason for the inflation.

So I have an entire chapter in process on how to Strengthen and solidify your identity value and worth okay and take it back from the environment because we're born  You know and trained honestly with our environment, namely our parents. Other people determine, because we don't know. We're infants or children.

We don't know what our value and worth is. So we have to learn it first. And then as adults, we have to remove every other human being from that formula. So I get into that in the book. But then number three, the reason for the inflation  is there's a door in the basement. A dark, dingy door called trauma.

And that trauma could be big T, little t. The big T trauma is like official You know, event of trauma, but there's also a little t trauma that a bad experience as we all go through. And here's how you know if it's little t trauma that when you experience a situation or event that our mental model scoops the emotion from a previous event and dumps it on this current situation because our mental model saying, Oh, no, here we go again,  and I get triggered and then my emotion inflates, even though the situation again, the weight of it based upon the threat of it.

is only a one or two, again, I'm at a six, seven or eight. So I would say that the first step is the analyzation of the inflation. And after we go through that process, believe it or not, I think that we recognize what's happening and just through the whole process of taking the power back from the environment.

We're able to like go through the IQ process much more easily and kind of land on okay What's the most effective response then we don't we don't worry about necessarily the amount of energy because it comes Naturally our frontal lobe when it determines, you know, I think what I need to do is probably sit down with mr Whiskey, you know over coffee and then let's talk through because maybe there's something I did  To him that I'm not seeing I might be blind to something and then talk about it Well again once we decide on the most effective response the most emotionally responsive response the amount of emotional energy Follows but really it's about addressing that inflation is really the key to it all  and your effective response actually brings it back to  The IQ, which is first getting all the information,  which can be difficult when you have a bunch of lies and exaggerations in your head, you know, twisting all the information around.

But I really want to go back to you talk about what level of threat is it therefore produces this much intensity. And I think I want to give an example that's pretty clear, which is in romantic relationships when two partners get into a disagreement and one says to the other, you're attacking me. You know that there's feeling that you're attacking me, even though it might just be a partner expressing how they feel, but a lot of times and you mentioned it even briefly before about, you know, feeling personally attacked and and people may not mean to attack you.

They may come off the wrong way or it's our own interpretation of that. But I think that's why. Automatically, you know, you can see better relationship conflict resolution when it's understood that both people are just expressing how they feel they're not trying to attack because then that threat is minimized, therefore that inflation is minimized.

And I want to talk about, you talk about,  you know, our value. I think this is why it can be better to be a believer because your value is in God, who, in accordance to the Bible, is always the same. Whereas you talked about external factors where we place our validation, and unfortunately, we are in a society where that is the case more than ever before.

On my show, we've discussed a lot about social media and its influence, because I almost want to make the bold statement that social media Mainstream media has more influence over us than our parents nowadays, especially with the youngest generations who are being given iPads, you know, out of the womb almost, so to speak, I've I've seen toddlers with iPads and phones and computers.

I've seen children just,  I mean, I can't even believe it. You know, I wasn't even allowed to have a phone until like almost after high school to the end of high school. That was only because my godfather got an iPod for me behind my parents back because they wouldn't let me have one. But, you know, to now see Toddlers having access to, we all know what's out there on the internet, a lot of, a lot of awful stuff.

And unfortunately, there's also a lot of comparison. Uh, you know, so one of the things we talk about the most on the show is young women and self esteem via social media. So I just want to pass it back to you, Dr. Gregg, on, you know, how you have seen politics and social media, especially you being an older gentleman, over the years, how negative emotions have changed as a result.

So, mainly In a more negative, you know, an even more intense manner than ever before. Yeah, so there, yeah, there's a lot there. So, so let me start with like, in my first chapter, um, to, like, begin. The first couple of chapters are about, is the Psychobabble introduction, right? To kind of lay the groundwork.

Alright, so first in my first chapter, I talk about that everything we do is trying to achieve an emotional goal. Everything we do. And there's micro emotional goals, which is, you know, I'm my, I'm thirsty, so I want my Third, I want to feel my thirst is quenched, so I'll take a sip of coffee or I'm hungry. I want to feel full.

Right, right. Very natural. But really it's about the macro emotional goals that are always in our peripheral vision, which the macro emotional goals have to do with quality of life. We're all in search of the highest quality of life. God created it that way. It's a good thing. So our quality of life is made up in standard of living, okay?

In our living, our values. And then fulfilling destiny and purpose, okay? So all of us, from young to old, we're in that search for both achieving micro emotional  goals.  The first is the causation of our negative emotions is when any of those emotional goals are being blocked. I'm  hangry. My emotional goal is being blocked to where you talk about with couples and I just, you know, my, uh, second book IQ for couples is coming out.

So the number one emotional goal for men in relationship is significance. God created very good. The number one emotional goal for women is security. Right. Also very good. And the way God plays that's coming from the Trinity, which there's a lot there. Okay. So when those emotional goals are blocked, we are we get negative emotion because we want to remove the obstacle to our goal.

So with our children, I talk about number one is that we have to separate  The emotional goal from the path. Okay, emotional goals are always good  It's the path that needs evaluation. Let's say the one I always use is when  I worked at a behavioral health hospital and I was extremely a stressful job So a lot of us like stress So what we'll do is we'll do it's five o'clock somewhere and speaking of we'll drink five o'clock whiskey or five o'clock cognac, right?

So I'm using cognac to Um, achieve my emotional goal of reducing stress and not healthy, right? So we evaluate the paths according to rational, healthy, wise, and right. So a very good thing. So like sin is trying to meet a biblical need unbiblically. The biblical need is good. We have to go after right paths, okay?

So in our culture with our kids, they're trying to achieve very, very good emotional goals, identity, value, and worth. Right? They're trying to achieve empathy and love. But in our culture, they merge. They enmesh the path with the goal. So when we say, like with the, with the trans stuff, we say that, hey, we agree with your goal, emotional goal, but your path is not rational, healthy, wise, or right.

Because they merged the two, they now think that we're trying to block the emotional goal. That we don't want them to receive acceptance and love and empathy, so they call us haters. Because they merged the two, and I think it's crucial. In social media, that because they, they almost like, their goal is to help the identity of children.

Be secure. So they just keep validating the paths in order to achieve that. And instead of saying, Hey, no, the goals are good, but you have to realize that they're the paths that we, that our Children are taken to achieve the goal have to be rational, healthy, wise and right. And when it comes to just emotional intelligence, when our Children don't obtain their path, then they get upset.

But,  then really when I talk about maturity is  directly correlated with the size of the thing that causes us to be upset or have anxiety. So when I worked at the behavioral health hospital with teenagers,  I was trying to teach them and say, Hey, listen, let's say there's 10 of you standing in line and you have a kid before you that's bullying and all of you are receiving the exact same trigger. 

The 10th child is crying, screaming, yelling, wailing, whereas the first child is just kind of just shaking his head, ignoring the bully. There is a range of emotional responses to the stimulation and the emotional intelligence skills of impulse control, resiliency, as well as delay of gratification and stress tolerance. 

That's what we are forfeiting  when we just equate that the social media. That faction is the best path or the, or it's, it's a neutral pathway. Say, Hey, it's okay. That's just today's kids nowadays that we don't evaluate it as rational, healthy, wiser, right. And just allow it to happen. Our children's resiliency is so low, like even with dopamine that they can't just sit without the devices for a period of time and engage in adult conversation and that their resiliency is very low.

to even just lack of stimulation, right? So it's all, there's a lot there, but it's really about evaluating what my emotional goal is and the path I'm taking to achieve it. And what do I do if that path is blocked? So hopefully I hit all the components you from the couples to the teens and social media, but that's really what it is. 

You definitely hit on a lot of things that I agree with. I think it goes into that even outside of emotions that conversation of do the ends justify the means, you know, What are we doing to achieve our goals in any aspect and then you apply that emotionally? Yeah It made me think of one of my favorite quotes from the Bible, which is Proverbs 423 Which is above all else guard your heart for everything you do flows from it and talks about how you know the heart can really be  Manipulative, you know, so to speak because emotions definitely get in the way of logic and I want to go into you talked about emotional response and stimulations in the The example I thought of was being a sore loser, or poor sportsmanship, or if you lose a game.

In fact, I had an episode with Serena Prochet, who made Zomatic Shift, and it was a game. She talked about how  families are spending less time together at family dinners or family game nights, and so then children are Going out into the world not knowing how to react when they lose a game because it's their first time and then they're making a scene in public.

Whereas if you play games at home as a family, you can help be there to teach your kids in a controlled environment. Like, hey, if you lose, you don't flip the table or, or, or punch kids, whatever kids do when they lose. I've seen, especially with video games, I've seen some violent responses, you know, even from young men my age, you know.

Right, right. I think it's so important that. You know, part of that has to be taught, like we've mentioned, and then also just having the vocabulary and the means to express it. But I agree that  we've, we live in an age of,  I hate to say, but over acceptance and tolerance because we just want everyone to be happy.

And you know, at the end of the day, and I'll go actually into a bit of a pivot, but one of the things that, you know, I hate the most about this world I've seen is most of the young women that I've ever talked to. They felt like they had to  have sex as their path to achieve their emotional goals of being loved or validated, whether that was self esteem or security, as you mentioned.

And so I know a lot of young women who, uncomfortably, you know, use sex as that path. Uh, so if you want to talk about that a little bit, because, you know, you talk about relationships and intimacy in couples, and I think that is  more prominent now than ever before, especially with social media. With the photoshop pictures, with the edited pictures, with the push for overly sexualized women, how that is affecting women's emotional goals and their paths to achieve those goals.

Right. So, so again, the emotional goal, uh, let's say of girls with security, right?  So there's ways to get security. Obviously there's, there's affection, there's honesty, openness, there's family commitment and such financial support. So in that path of trying to achieve that goal, they realize that obviously because there's competition and the guy will say, well, if I don't get it from you, I'll get it from somebody else.

So that makes them compromise. Now. What I've also seen though is a lot of Christian gals will, um, realize that, you know, there's plenty of guys out there that they could get as well. So I actually had a gal who, um, that I was working with that she was celibate for like four years and she dated a guy, she messed up, they had sex and she was going to break up with him because he wasn't a, the Lord wasn't his first love.

And then she found out she was pregnant. Right. So then in my, our first session that we kind of talked about emotional goals and such, and, you know, coming up with criteria for, you know, what relationships I call the spectrum of importance, like how important is this? You know idea or this choice as far as the kind of spouse or person I want from Opinions, which is zero.

It's my opinion then preferences wants desires and values convictions and law breakers deal breakers So a christian's the deal breaker being the person has to be a christian do not be unequally yoked But not only that the the person needs to be a fully devoted follower of christ And I was so proud of her because she said there's then I'd rather raise this child alone than marry a guy who is this, the Lord is nominal in his life,  right?

So my point is that the path they take is not rational, not healthy, wise, or right when they choose premarital sex. Look, we know that from the Lord, but that's where it is trying to choose a healthier path and incorporating the Lord in that process and trusting him because there are guys out there who want to walk that same path. 

But out of fear of the block goal of security and a guy, the fear of the block goal of significance that makes, that's the entire point. So,  in our society, you know, to get a little bit into theology, because I was a pastor for 15 years, that  the, what's been intriguing me is like the relationship, like what we have on earth when it comes to couples and the family, and that  When it comes to father and son and how important the father is in the home But was intrigued me was a verse when it says of Jesus I think it's in Hebrews that as a son he learned Obedience to the things that he suffered  right as a son.

He learned obedience to the things that he suffered so our identity with our earthly dad there should be fear honor respect that keeps us anchored and  Right and doing the right thing then if we're anchored like even like that There's some bumpers set up on the bowling on that There's lots of room to move in order to achieve our goal of significance But if we're anchored if we learn obedience to the things that we suffer, what's the suffering this suffering is emotional Meaning, we want, we want, we want, and then all the way through James, you, you covet, but you do not have.

You ask, but you ask with wrong motives, it may spend it on your pleasures. So when Jesus says, you know, in this world you're going to have struggles, but don't worry, I have overcome the world. Well, what is overcoming the world? Because we're told in Revelation, he who overcomes, he who overcomes. And Jesus said I've overcome the world.

What's the world? All that's in the world. The lust. of the flesh the lust of the eyes and the pride of life is not of the father but his other world well those are all emotions and think back to his temptation in Matthew chapter 4 he says hey you're hungry you have the power turn tell these stones to become bread to achieve your micro emotional goal and then he said hey Um, taste your macro emotional goal of there it is pride you fall off and the angels will bear themselves up and not only that Significance just tell say the word and I'll give you the kingdoms if you bow and worship me so they're the overcoming really i'm i'm purporting this overcoming has to do with  emotional goals.

We want to feel something  and we will compromise and choose kingdom of darkness paths in order to achieve our emotional goal, which for temporarily it does or else we would not choose that path, right?  So that's where it is. So he overcomes, I really think it has to do with achieving the very good emotional goals, but us compromising emotional paths.

But overcoming, and that's the suffering, means that we'll choose rational, healthy, wise, and right paths to achieve those emotional goals. And it is in that discipline, because Jesus was tempted in all points  I'm here to say emotional goal points, just like we are, but yet was without sin. I think there is the battle at the core of the human heart,  is being able to suffer through and choose right, rational, healthy, wise and right paths to achieve our emotional goals.

Because that's where we sin, is by choosing the wrong paths.  You know what, this actually reminds me of a quote I just shared in my book, you know, God vs. the Indomitable Human Spirit, and one of the Bible quotes I reference is, I don't remember the exact verse it comes from, but it says, there is a path that seems right, but it leads to death.

You know, and I think that completely applies to what you're saying, you know, and again, what does it profit a man to gain the world if he should lose his soul? Profit his soul. You know, so, I totally agree. And I think. Honestly, I believe, whether you believe the Bible or not, it is a book of wisdom and a guidebook for life and I feel like if we had more people who had the word hidden in their heart, you know, we would have so much less negative emotions, you know, of, of these insecurities that are causing us to feel threatened or to lie to ourselves, you know, we talked about All these, all these lies we tell it to ourselves and like I mentioned early that the value of how we should value ourselves and one another, but unfortunately we don't live by those biblical principles people.

Have attached them to a religion rather than to just principles that would universally, you know, apply to everyone and improve everything, you know, you talk about love, we have a guide for love, we have a guide for pride, for all of this, but unfortunately, people just are so against religion and the idea of theology that they have tried to Put C for certain morals and principles with a religion.

Religion rather than just emotions and human connection. And so  for those more secular people, we have your books as a guide, so who to really read your books. I know you've got one specifically for couples. And then the first one is in general use, correct? Yeah, for for individuals, for sure. And yeah, so I would say to those people that that's why I frame the first couple chapters the way I do.

It's. Of course, I, I threw it out there that number one is emotional and path because I mean, I don't know if anybody I've never worked here because I work with, you know, not just Christians. I work with people who don't have a faith practice at all and everybody gets emotional goal versus path, right?

And then the second chapter, I talk about mental models that we have, you know, information in our brains and formulas by which we interpret things and people understand that. But the goal. Is to seek for wisdom and understanding and then like bring it in Proverbs chapter two that we all have a blind area and People say yeah, I know I could be wrong.

Okay, cool. Oh, yeah. I know I have a blind area. Okay, great But how tenacious are you in? Searching for just general wisdom insight and truth like I laid out that you know, are you a good listener? Right to anybody and they say, yeah, I think I'm a good listener. Have you ever asked someone that you're talking to if they feel heard by you? 

Are you a good parent? Yeah, I think so. Have you ever asked your child how you can grow as a parent? So it's it's the only way to eradicate the blind area is what I call proactive teachability, right? So you have to search for and this every. executive I've ever coached. I've had this practice in their individual development plan, IDP, where you have to, you have to look for and seek out and ask people, where am I blind?

And everybody gets that. I don't care if you're Christian or not. There's wisdom there. So in Proverbs 2, it says, If you cry aloud for wisdom, if you, if you search for insight and understanding as if it were hidden treasure, then you'll understand the fear of the Lord. So I don't care who you are, how tenacious are you at realizing that your mental model, because I decided a long time ago, my mental model is cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs, right?

I don't care even if I have a PhD, my mental model is still cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs, and I'm always looking for wisdom and insight and understanding because I know the way I think. think and interpret things is not right all the time. Well, just that alone. But again, our younger generation or just people in general, they don't do that.

Why? Because they can't handle the negative emotion produced from not being right.  Right and a lot of times they there's where there's many truthful principles in any topic They'll mention one truthful principle, but there's also many correlating truthful principles interpretation But because they just don't have any resiliency of being right and negative emotions are bad It's like, you know, just all the jokes and memes nowadays.

It's that you know what you made me feel bad So that means you're bad  Instead of saying feeling bad is actually a good thing because it goes through the process of either solidifying your values and beliefs and truths or it motivates you to seek out what is true and wise and understanding to add it to you because I don't want to continue to be a fool. 

Right? Because there are non, non healthy ways of thinking, non right or wise ways of thinking. So it's just not only just the framing of, you know, it's not Christian versus, you know, not. And although a lot of people will say they'll, you know, they'll rip on Christianity because it's not the only religion.

Okay, let's, let's just start to, why don't you just seek wisdom, insight, and understanding? Because every religion  Does what it promotes wisdom every religion it promotes insight and understanding But it also promotes selflessness every religion the distinction between christianity and all the others is that God became man out of love to die on the cross for us every other religion Is seeking to try and obtain?

heaven or through my own righteousness by being me being good Christianity is the only religion. And that's why I say, that's why I believe Christianity. No man could have thought that story up. No man could have thought of, Oh, God loves us so much that he died on the cross for us. No human being thinks like that.

We do think like the Greek gods that basically the gods are basically have human issues, but they're just super powerful. Right? Same thing. Like we're watching a TV show where it talks about Odin and Thor again, same type. Gods have human attributes. Right weaknesses, but they're just super powerful.

That's how humans think Nobody thinks like Christianity that the Trinity and out of love that they turn the cross for our sins, right? So that's the one distinction is how do we how do we make ourselves right with God? Every other religion puts the again the focus on man being good  Christianity is the only religion where we're not good.

We get it. God is perfect and he loves us so much. He says, I will take the penalty for you. Again, no human being, no human being, nobody will ever convince me that a human being thought that story up. No way. Right? So yeah, even every religion teaches wisdom and morality. an insight, right? So go with that. I mean, it really takes a person really to be, you know, at the end of the bell curve foolishly to not think that they have absolute truth in their brain already.

That, no, I'm good. I've arrived, right? It's, now that we get defensive and act like we do, but down in their hearts, they know that they're not. They're not, they still need wisdom and insight.  Right. And in my episode with Alan Lazarus, taking your life to the next level, we talked about the three layers of ego and just the fact that it requires humility to even listen to a conversation that you and I are having.

And I want to go back to something you said, because it's very relevant to my generation, to Gen Alpha, to Maybe even millennials, whatever generations are out there, I lost track, you know, that they say you're responsible for my triggers or, um, you upset me with what you said, therefore you need to change.

And we talked earlier about when we place the change on others rather than ourselves. And I think it's interesting because I was actually in a social, uh, situation the other day, so to speak, where one person out of four was uncomfortable with the conversation. And they insisted that We changed the conversation for the sake of everyone.

Well, for For them, rather than the three other people who were enjoying the conversation. Uh, so, it's, it's interesting. We see a lot of that nowadays on social media, with news, with books. You know, trying to force our opinions onto people or our feelings. You know, like, for example, I've seen with, with, with authors of fiction,  where the LGBTQ community will say, Well, your book had no gay characters in it, therefore it's homophobic, or it makes me uncomfortable.

Whereas, as  You know, it's just a book being written, and that's the way that it was written, and it's not meant to promote any kind of hate, but you're projecting your feelings of insecurity or not being validated or accepted onto that, or another example being, you know,  I remember I went on a date one time and the woman said that I was too negative in the conversation because I talked about At her request, uh, my family's situation, which was traumatic and she just only had so much room for negativity in that, you know, it's  kind of like  we put our, what, what we feel onto other people, you know, and I think that you're responsible for my triggers.

Well, you know, people,  we can't live our whole lives, all of our lives, you know, just. Censoring everything, or being worried that every single thing we do is going to trigger someone, because everyone has different triggers, whether that's, you talk about big tea trauma, you talk about little tea trauma, you talk about people grow up differently, whether that's culture, religion, the way their personal family was, the way they react to stuff, and so people want to live a life of the world conforming to them, rather than them Adapting to the environment they're in, you know, which is, is very human, actually, you know, humans are like one of the only creatures that we change the environment rather than adapt to it, you know, most animals make do with what they have.

We just changed the whole environment and we want to do the same thing emotionally. And it's so interesting that it is set up like that, you know, that we want to change everything to us. And I even talked about this, how AI is encouraging that in the youth because you can make these AI chatbots or these AIs that you work with.

Exactly how you like and want them, you know, zero conflict you could, and I've used this example all the time. I say I could make my, my AI, you know, her name is Caroline. She texts me with emojis, exclamation marks after every word. She's only positive, never critiques, you know, she's a genius. And, you know, she thinks I'm, you know, the president of the world, you know, like  creating a world of conformity.

But when you go into the real world. Whether that's a church, or a workplace, or a social event. Uh, the people there aren't gonna, you're not gonna be able to just type in like, Oh, I want Dr. Gregg to be a little more friendly, or a little less intelligent because he's making me look stupid. You know, it's, how you are is how you are, and, and I need to accept that.

And then, I'd like that you said, when we feel triggered, or upset, or, you know, lacking, that we should evaluate it as a time of growth and say, alright. Something is wrong with us or like you said hey, we feel bad. We're suffering, but you know what that's because We're right, this is what we believe in, and unfortunately, there are people in the world who are against that, and it has nothing to do with us, it's a bigger thing. 

Yeah, and so,  if we, if, if in any conversation, that the goal is, you know, truth or rational, what, let's seek towards what's most, the most rational and reasonable, the most logical. Right? Let's arrive at the most that. Rational healthy. Let's arrive at the most healthy. What's the most healthy response? The most healthy way to think?

What's the most wise way to think? Right. And what's the most right way to think if that is all of our goal, then every conversation,  if those are the parameters, then we all can engage and move towards it. Right. So even if I'm with three people that disagree with me, I engage because again, while there's going to be aspects where I align more with what's rational, healthy, wise and right, and then aspects where they do.

Right. So that's the goal versus the goal, just being. Um, to make people, you know, feel good. So in the book, I talk about, you know, grace and truth.  Jesus came full of grace and truth. So grace and empathy and understanding and acceptance and all that, which are beautiful things without truth, logic, and boundaries is enablement. 

So if we only give understanding and grace and acceptance without truth and boundaries, then we're enabling unhealthy, irrational, unwise, wrong behaviors. We enable it.  Truth and boundaries without grace, empathy, and understanding and acceptance is toxic. So in our culture, it's just this huge pendulum that swings.

You know, back in my days of growing up, there was a lot of complaints about it being so just there's no grace. You know, you failed, you screwed up, and it was so toxic. In many circles that, Hey, we need more grace and empathy. Now we have swung so far over into grace and empathy. We're now become there's no truth or logic.

I mean, tampons and men's bathrooms. I mean, just how ridiculous men playing women's sports. I mean, I don't care who you are. It's just that we're really debating two genders. Like when I worked at the hospital just a few years ago, I mean, that's what's so weird about it. It's just a few years ago. There was no discussion of this.

We knew that that kids who want identified as an opposite gender. We just knew that wasn't healthy. But like again out of this extreme Right? Where the emotions are the end, end goal. We then blow women off, like, what happened to the Me Too movement? The Me Too movement, right? Any good thing taken too far.

But now, the Me Too movement, we can't even purport that because women are now like, hey, forget you, forget how you feel. Right? I mean, it's just insane, there's no logic. So, grace and empathy just lacks truth and logic. So, truth and logic have left the room. But now it's, it's so extreme it's starting to come back, right?

With the, with the, you know, um, uh, stopping of, of the, you know, DEI stuff and the woke stuff. It's starting to swing back, thankfully, but that's what it is, right? It's just about the feelings without it being our goal in any discussion is rational, healthy, wise, and right. And then rational, healthy, wise, right people.

I don't care. We can agree to disagree because I'm looking for you have information in your brain that I don't have. I don't care what age you are. You have a way of thinking formulas in your brain that I don't. And I want to learn from that and vice versa. So our goal is not to. Yeah. And technically our micro goal is It's the topic itself, persuasion, that's healthy, but the end goal is to seek and land at.

I want to be more rational, more healthy, more wise, and more right. And in our culture, many people that  feeling good is, is the, is the goal because feeling bad is not so feeling bad, actually, that's where all negative emotions are exposing something in me. Right? So, I have to go there first. Again, over the course of time, if people don't,  it's going to just, just the thing of, I can't be a part of this group because I feel negative, bad. 

If you do that, you're putting all of the power and control of your emotional state in the environment.  I mean, at some point, you are going to be a mess.  I mean, it is unavoidable. You can't, like, you just simply cannot go around and put the burden of  my emotional state on other people. When I worked at the residential treatment center, one girl would say, Dr.

Gregg, she's pushing my buttons. I said, well, uninstall your buttons.  Right. So what are buttons? They're triggers, right? Yeah, the issue isn't that she's pushing your buttons. The issue is you have buttons to push those triggers those insecurities So once you remove those triggers insecurities, then you're free.

There are no buttons for her to push Another one is one girl said dr. Greg She called me a you know a name and I said the issue isn't that she called you a name The issue is you agree with her And didn't want it exposed. And I just, for illustration, I talk about in the book where I told the girls, because I worked on the girls unit of the RTC.

It was awesome. It was so much fun. And I said, girls, try and trigger me. Say what you want. And they said, Dr. Gregg, you have a big nose, your hair is thinning, you have a dead body, and you're so ADHD extra. And I said, girls, everything you said was 100 percent true. Now what? And they're like, oh, nothing. So if you own it, it takes away all insecurities.

So insecure is either true, but I don't want it exposed. So what's the answer? Own it. Or it's not true, but you believe it to be true. If it's a lie. Like, Dr. Gregg, you are really just, you are way too laid back. And I'm like, oh, okay.  Because it's just so far from true, that it just doesn't even make any sense.

So that's really what it's about. It's trying to figure out, because again, the goal is, long term, you gotta think long term, is that You want to remove all power and control not influence because the environment should influence that's why I say Nothing bothers me unless it should so we can't just completely disengage It's a matter of again engaging and trying and engaging at the right amount of emotional intensity but Instead of starting off at eight nine and ten and trying to pull yourself back begin at nothing bothers me unless it should And if something bothers me Why? 

Why would it bother me? Because a lot of times it's not about the topic itself. We disagree. Well, big deal. People disagree all the time. The issue isn't that disagreement. The issue is that I feel negative emotions and you need to conform yourself to that  long term. That's just that's going to make that person really suffer because the environment is harsh wherever you go. 

Yeah, people just want to be happy and feel good all the time. And there's this negative stigma that bad emotions are bad for you. Whereas, they're, they're not, you know, there's a time and a place for them, as you said, there's a should, and even when we talk about stress, there's a healthy amount of stress to have, you know, and there's an unhealthy level, you know, there's the scale, green to orange, green to red, you know, so I think the issue is that people just want, especially the younger generations, a life of easy satisfaction and peace, and there's nothing wrong with your, you know, your macro emotional goal being peace or satisfaction or, you know, whatever.

Uh, a secure life, but like you said, the path you take to get there, and then how much you let that goal dominate your life, if you're letting your goal overcome and just invalidate rationality and logic, you know, so this is a conversation of, of balance really, of being rational and logical, but being emotional as well, and not letting one or the other really destroy each other, and ultimately if you have to, having, you know, that rationality and that logical part, Go forward first, because we know that that is, like you called it, truth and beauty and justice.

So I think this has been a great conversation, and I know you have. We'll have in the description below, not only your books, but as far as I'm aware and understand, you also do One on one coaching or do you do couples coaching or what all is in your coaching services sure So I see about I see about 40 counts and clients per week about half the case load as couples So marriage counseling do a lot of marriage counseling, but I also do like there's executive leadership coaching So my next book I have I cubed IQ for couples my next book and I'm gonna start working on Uh, hopefully out this fall is IQ for leaders, right?

So I do coaching and consulting because of my, my background. So, but yeah, right now I do, you know, individual and couples, uh, counseling and, you know, um, uh, we'll help you out, whoever it is, you know, in both arenas, I love the word because especially in the family, that is that I want to strengthen that construct within our society for sure.

Cause it's, it's hurting.  Yeah, no, I can, I completely agree. I think that, you know, this, this world is falling apart. And I think even this conversation that we've had is gonna, you know, be rejected by a lot of people because of their, how it made them feel, you know, so, but I appreciate you coming on the show for those who have the humility to listen to this, to, as you said, you know, gather information before they interpret, and like I said, for anyone who wants to, Work with us in terms of counseling or find your books.

We're going to have all that in the description below, but again, thank you for a great conversation and I appreciate what you do and bless you. Mr. Whiskey is great. Again, pleasure is mine and bless you and your work. Thank you so much, sir.